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RoseRed135

Defining "Toxic"

73 posts in this topic

Posted (edited)

In NewMama's thread, "Taking a TO," Oscar said:

I have a new theory: MIL's only get to be graded "annoying" when their lying, emotional manipulation (guilting, threatening anger) and entitlement have zero effect on a marriage due to a couple's ironclad boundaries.

If this is so, then, it seems to me, that also means that MILs (or FILs)  "only get graded" as "toxic" if their relationship w/ DS and DiL (or DD and SIL) is problematic. If so, does that mean that only a relationship can be toxic, not an individual person?

Thoughts?

 

Edited by RoseRed135
clarity

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I clearly remember and argument DH & I had over his mom....it was one of those "she didn't mean it like that" in defense of his mom things when I reacted very strongly to being raked over the coals for doing something actually in her greater interest. My response was "she doesn't get to treat me like that". It was such a new concept for him, she'd always treated everyone "like that" when she was upset and it was always rug swept until she got over it then they pretended nothing had happened. I went VLC for a good long while. I remained polite when I saw her, but didn't interact intentionally and didn't host...not hosting is what got DH to actually get it then he began to totally have my back the rest of her life. 

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If you has asked me if there were "toxic" people in this world 13 years ago (pre-MIL moving right next door to "take care" of GS) I would have said no, I would have said that I believe that there is always some good in a person, you just have to find it. However I know now that I was inexperienced and naive, and there are toxic people, not just toxic relationships. My MIL, whether it is due to mental illness or behavioral disorder etc, is a toxic person.  I now believe this as much as I believe the Earth is round.... and although I (DIL) am the primary target/focus of her current outrage... I am by no means the only one, between her multiple divorces, her estrangement from her entire family, and the few of her "friends" that still associate with her - well I am in good company. 

I think the key is the patterns and what the common denominator might be... My DH and I have a saying we use... "If it happens once it might be them, if it happens twice it might still be them, but if it happens a third time... well then it might be you" ;)  

 

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On 8/15/2017 at 11:26 AM, Tobias41 said:

If you has asked me if there were "toxic" people in this world 13 years ago (pre-MIL moving right next door to "take care" of GS) I would have said no, I would have said that I believe that there is always some good in a person, you just have to find it. However I know now that I was inexperienced and naive, and there are toxic people, not just toxic relationships. My MIL, whether it is due to mental illness or behavioral disorder etc, is a toxic person.  I now believe this as much as I believe the Earth is round.... and although I (DIL) am the primary target/focus of her current outrage... I am by no means the only one, between her multiple divorces, her estrangement from her entire family, and the few of her "friends" that still associate with her - well I am in good company. 

I think the key is the patterns and what the common denominator might be... My DH and I have a saying we use... "If it happens once it might be them, if it happens twice it might still be them, but if it happens a third time... well then it might be you" ;) 

Three strikes? Sounds good. You're out, over and done.

Anonymous poster hash: ea945...f93

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I told my son and his girlfriend that there relationship was "toxic" because they constantly try to hurt each other and never seem to learn that words cannot be "taken back after they are said"

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Some relationships last a lifetime that way-  Even when the toxicity isnt constantly present, it does rear its ugly head from time to time one year after the next-  There's a stretch of kindness, then a stretch of ugliness, like it runs in cycles, and there is no telling when it will quit or begin- A lifetime of that .. and as they age it can become dangerous ..

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Some people are absolutely toxic. They have personality disorders. There are ways to identify them. For example, if a person knows something really aggravates you and once they know, they take pains to do the behavior more once they know it bugs you, that's toxic. People who are constantly passive -aggressive towards you are toxic. People who smear you behind your back are toxic. If you read Toxic Parents by Susan Forward, there is a lot more information. 

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To my DH (who grew up in his FOO's family dynamic), his FOO are only "annoying." It's like someone on here once explained to me, DH grew up with jellyfish who sting. He's impervious to the stinging. I'm not, they're toxic to me, so I have to stay away. Interestingly, now that DH has understood how toxic they can be, his "immunity" to their toxicity isn't what it once was. He's a lot more careful around them.

But really, now I'm second-guessing that analogy a little....perhaps he had only learned to live with the effects of toxicity. Once he realizes how enjoyable life is without the ick in his life, he just doesn't want to visit the jellyfish pool as much anymore.

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On 8/17/2017 at 9:12 AM, INCOGNITO said:

Three strikes? Sounds good. You're out, over and done.

Anonymous poster hash: ea945...f93

Pretty much, but remember like anything it depends on the situation, and some times looking at the "man in the mirror" can be hard too.. I did alot of self evaluation to be sure I was not being unreasonable... WE gave MIL alot more than 3x and your out, but that is because we were not 100% out of the blame and of course she was family... I am sure things could have been handled better on our (DH and I) side as well...

Now that I think about it, I guess part of it is also... what is the "average"? Is it always toxic? Or are the good things with the bad... 

 

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On 8/15/2017 at 6:11 AM, RoseRed135 said:

In NewMama's thread, "Taking a TO," Oscar said:

I have a new theory: MIL's only get to be graded "annoying" when their lying, emotional manipulation (guilting, threatening anger) and entitlement have zero effect on a marriage due to a couple's ironclad boundaries.

If this is so, then, it seems to me, that also means that MILs (or FILs)  "only get graded" as "toxic" if their relationship w/ DS and DiL (or DD and SIL) is problematic. If so, does that mean that only a relationship can be toxic, not an individual person?

Thoughts?

 

I definitely see toxic people. Highly contagious, I simply wish I had been vaccinated. It's so difficult to respond calmly, when approached by said individuals.

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Posted (edited)

9 hours ago, Forthebabies said:

I definitely see toxic people. Highly contagious, I simply wish I had been vaccinated. It's so difficult to respond calmly, when approached by said individuals.

First saw this late last night... now I'm wondering if you feel the DTR and her SO that you've had so much trouble with are, unfortunately, among those "toxic people?"

ETA: Also, in another thread, you mention a "teen DTR." Just to be clear, is she the mother of your GC/the one w/ the difficult SO or is that a different DTR?

Edited by RoseRed135

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I believe a toxic individual is a "poisonous" individual to both themselves and anyone they come in contact with, whether or not the other people have set up boundaries.  If an individual, for example, is totally self-centered, only sees the bad in others, speaks ill of others always, lies about others, takes from everyone in their life and never gives in return, and sees every moment of their life as the "glass half-empty" ... then I believe that individual will be toxic to themselves as well as to others.  My MIL is sadly like that and is never happy, and no one can ever do enough for her, and no matter what you do, she will badmouth you behind your back.  I am a new member.  In April of this year, you posted a query of mine about my MIL insisting that she sit at the head of the table, even though I had repeatedly let her know that was the place for my DH, her DS.  It is now four months later, and last night at our home, I had a birthday party for my DH with 11 guests, one of which was my MIL.  Well, lo and behold, my MIL sits right down at my husband's place at the table.  I was not up to saying anything to her, and then my DH swooped down next to me, put his hand on my hand, and lovingly said to me, "Don't worry honey, I'm going to sit right next to you, we'll be together, and that will be even better."  And so, with those loving words, I deemed the issue unimportant and had a wonderful time celebrating DH's birthday.  Then this morning I get a phone call from DD2 who had driven MIL home last night.  DD2 informed me this morning that one of the things MIL, her grandmother, told her on the way home last night was this, "Out of my five kids, the only kid who has smart kids is Mary." (names are changed.)  Then MIL proceeds to tell her granddaughter, my DD2, that her cousins "Hillary, Janet and Ruth," daughters of Mary, are so brilliant, beautiful and talented, and then goes into intricate detail as to why each one of them is so extraordinary.  And that "none of her other kids' children come even close to Mary's kids."  DD2 was very upset this morning that her own grandmother was literally explaining to her why she didn't measure up to her cousins, Mary's kids.  Now, mind you, DD2 is happily married, her and her DH have good jobs and own their own home, unlike any of the other cousins, so what my MIL is saying doesn't even make sense.  In my 37 years of marriage to  my DH, I have NEVER contacted my MIL about any of the hurtful things she has said behind my back.  But this, to me, crossed a line.  I called my MIL, and when she answered the phone, I told her I was upset about something she said to DD2.  Her reply was shocking to me, "What NOW, Tricia?!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"  To which I replied, "this is the first time I have ever called you about anything upsetting to me."  She then responded as a volcano erupting, screaming, ranting, raving, "NO ONE SPOKE TO ME ALL NIGHT LAST NIGHT AT THE PARTY!!!!  YOU WERE TALKING ABOUT YOUR JOB!!!!!"  (What she said was totally untrue.). The venom and vicious words that were then spewed at me were incredulous, with her SCREAMING at me at the top of her lungs.  In all my life, I have never been the recipient of anything like it.  While she was continually screaming at me, I tried to tell her what had upset me, but she wouldn't listen.  I simply hung up the phone.  I was shaking for a half-hour after that.  This was the first time that I ever tried telling my MIL that something she said upset me, and her response was way over the top and frightening.  This pales in comparison to the "head of the table" issue.

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26 minutes ago, Tricia1 said:

I believe a toxic individual is a "poisonous" individual to both themselves and anyone they come in contact with, whether or not the other people have set up boundaries.  If an individual, for example, is totally self-centered, only sees the bad in others, speaks ill of others always, lies about others, takes from everyone in their life and never gives in return, and sees every moment of their life as the "glass half-empty" ... then I believe that individual will be toxic to themselves as well as to others.  My MIL is sadly like that and is never happy, and no one can ever do enough for her, and no matter what you do, she will badmouth you behind your back.  I am a new member.  In April of this year, you posted a query of mine about my MIL insisting that she sit at the head of the table, even though I had repeatedly let her know that was the place for my DH, her DS.  It is now four months later, and last night at our home, I had a birthday party for my DH with 11 guests, one of which was my MIL.  Well, lo and behold, my MIL sits right down at my husband's place at the table.  I was not up to saying anything to her, and then my DH swooped down next to me, put his hand on my hand, and lovingly said to me, "Don't worry honey, I'm going to sit right next to you, we'll be together, and that will be even better."  And so, with those loving words, I deemed the issue unimportant and had a wonderful time celebrating DH's birthday.  Then this morning I get a phone call from DD2 who had driven MIL home last night.  DD2 informed me this morning that one of the things MIL, her grandmother, told her on the way home last night was this, "Out of my five kids, the only kid who has smart kids is Mary." (names are changed.)  Then MIL proceeds to tell her granddaughter, my DD2, that her cousins "Hillary, Janet and Ruth," daughters of Mary, are so brilliant, beautiful and talented, and then goes into intricate detail as to why each one of them is so extraordinary.  And that "none of her other kids' children come even close to Mary's kids."  DD2 was very upset this morning that her own grandmother was literally explaining to her why she didn't measure up to her cousins, Mary's kids.  Now, mind you, DD2 is happily married, her and her DH have good jobs and own their own home, unlike any of the other cousins, so what my MIL is saying doesn't even make sense.  In my 37 years of marriage to  my DH, I have NEVER contacted my MIL about any of the hurtful things she has said behind my back.  But this, to me, crossed a line.  I called my MIL, and when she answered the phone, I told her I was upset about something she said to DD2.  Her reply was shocking to me, "What NOW, Tricia?!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"  To which I replied, "this is the first time I have ever called you about anything upsetting to me."  She then responded as a volcano erupting, screaming, ranting, raving, "NO ONE SPOKE TO ME ALL NIGHT LAST NIGHT AT THE PARTY!!!!  YOU WERE TALKING ABOUT YOUR JOB!!!!!"  (What she said was totally untrue.). The venom and vicious words that were then spewed at me were incredulous, with her SCREAMING at me at the top of her lungs.  In all my life, I have never been the recipient of anything like it.  While she was continually screaming at me, I tried to tell her what had upset me, but she wouldn't listen.  I simply hung up the phone.  I was shaking for a half-hour after that.  This was the first time that I ever tried telling my MIL that something she said upset me, and her response was way over the top and frightening.  This pales in comparison to the "head of the table" issue.

Wow. Just wow.

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Posted (edited)

@Tricia1 - So sorry that DD2 had to face this - and you, as well.How awful! MIL is lucky you even took the time to try to explain yourself and didn't just hang up sooner!

But I'm wondering, is it possible MIL is suffering from some kind of mental condition? She seems very unstable to me.

Regardless, I think, perhaps, you need to take a  (long) TO (time out) from MIL. DD2 probably should, also, but that, of course, is up to her. She's still DH's mom, of course, so he may want to maintain a relationship w/ her, but he can arrange to do that on his own.

Then again, he might not want to see MIL for a while since she hurt his DD and was so vile to you. Unless he wants to see if he can get her to go for a checkup. Have you had a chance to tell him what happened as yet?

On a now-less significant note - about the "head of the table" issue - in a previous post you said you thought that next time DH should speak to MIL about this beforehand. Did that happen?

Edited by RoseRed135
to correct an error

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Just curious, did you think to let DH deal with MIL instead of upsetting yourself? 

Anonymous poster hash: e4647...4ab

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Posted (edited)

4 hours ago, Tricia1 said:
3 hours ago, INCOGNITO said:

Just curious, did you think to let DH deal with MIL instead of upsetting yourself? 

Anonymous poster hash: e4647...4ab

I believe a toxic individual is a "poisonous" individual to both themselves and anyone they come in contact with, whether or not the other people have set up boundaries.  If an individual, for example, is totally self-centered, only sees the bad in others, speaks ill of others always, lies about others, takes from everyone in their life and never gives in return, and sees every moment of their life as the "glass half-empty" ... then I believe that individual will be toxic to themselves as well as to others.  My MIL is sadly like that and is never happy, and no one can ever do enough for her, and no matter what you do, she will badmouth you behind your back.  I am a new member.  In April of this year, you posted a query of mine about my MIL insisting that she sit at the head of the table, even though I had repeatedly let her know that was the place for my DH, her DS.  It is now four months later, and last night at our home, I had a birthday party for my DH with 11 guests, one of which was my MIL.  Well, lo and behold, my MIL sits right down at my husband's place at the table.  I was not up to saying anything to her, and then my DH swooped down next to me, put his hand on my hand, and lovingly said to me, "Don't worry honey, I'm going to sit right next to you, we'll be together, and that will be even better."  And so, with those loving words, I deemed the issue unimportant and had a wonderful time celebrating DH's birthday.  Then this morning I get a phone call from DD2 who had driven MIL home last night.  DD2 informed me this morning that one of the things MIL, her grandmother, told her on the way home last night was this, "Out of my five kids, the only kid who has smart kids is Mary." (names are changed.)  Then MIL proceeds to tell her granddaughter, my DD2, that her cousins "Hillary, Janet and Ruth," daughters of Mary, are so brilliant, beautiful and talented, and then goes into intricate detail as to why each one of them is so extraordinary.  And that "none of her other kids' children come even close to Mary's kids."  DD2 was very upset this morning that her own grandmother was literally explaining to her why she didn't measure up to her cousins, Mary's kids.  Now, mind you, DD2 is happily married, her and her DH have good jobs and own their own home, unlike any of the other cousins, so what my MIL is saying doesn't even make sense.  In my 37 years of marriage to  my DH, I have NEVER contacted my MIL about any of the hurtful things she has said behind my back.  But this, to me, crossed a line.  I called my MIL, and when she answered the phone, I told her I was upset about something she said to DD2.  Her reply was shocking to me, "What NOW, Tricia?!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"  To which I replied, "this is the first time I have ever called you about anything upsetting to me."  She then responded as a volcano erupting, screaming, ranting, raving, "NO ONE SPOKE TO ME ALL NIGHT LAST NIGHT AT THE PARTY!!!!  YOU WERE TALKING ABOUT YOUR JOB!!!!!"  (What she said was totally untrue.). The venom and vicious words that were then spewed at me were incredulous, with her SCREAMING at me at the top of her lungs.  In all my life, I have never been the recipient of anything like it.  While she was continually screaming at me, I tried to tell her what had upset me, but she wouldn't listen.  I simply hung up the phone.  I was shaking for a half-hour after that.  This was the first time that I ever tried telling my MIL that something she said upset me, and her response was way over the top and frightening.  This pales in comparison to the "head of the table" issue.

MIL What NOW TRICIA?!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! "This is the firsts time I've ever called you about something upsetting me.  Then just after your post we have incognito suggesting you should have had your husband relay your complaints about your MIL to her.  How many times have you had your husband talk to her about something upsetting you? Because I can honestsly say that if my son repeatedly voiced complaints that my DIL has about me I might say What now  too.

I'm not saying your MIL is right.  But she might be right about the What NOW Tricia.

Edited by skipped

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I'm new to this, and I couldn't figure out how to reply to individual posts, so I'm responding to the three.  RoseRed135, we are both of the same mindset.  I agree with everything that you said.  In answer to your question, I don't remember if my DH spoke with MIL about the head of the table issue.  I believe the next few times that she came here for dinner, she respected it.  But last night, she did not.

Incognito, this was the very first time I had ever said to my mother-in-law, "I'm upset with what you said ... "  I have never complained to her about anything ever.  The only thing I have ever done was a few times ask her to respect our wishes that DH sit at the head of the table.  In the past, my husband has always been the one to deal with any of his family matters, but none of those matters involved any complaints about my MIL from me.  But when I found out that my MIL told my daughter that she did not measure up to her cousins, I wanted to call her myself, because I felt she had crossed a line, and I wanted her to realize how hurtful I felt her words were.  Had I known that she would respond with an unreasonable rage, and not even let me speak, I would have never called her.  The only words I got out of my mouth were, "I am upset about what you said to Melanie last night." 

Skipped, number one, I have never had my husband speak to my MIL about any complaints about her from me.  I have never ever in the past told her I was upset with her.  In all the years we've been married, the only thing I have ever said to her that was in any way like a complaint was when, a few times, I asked her to please let my DH sit at the head of the table, which she does not respect.  The only thing we are guilty of is taking her out to dinners, having her to our home for dinners, celebrations and holidays, doing countless chores for her at her home, and driving her to appointments.  But in direct answer to your query, no, my husband has never voiced any complaints from me to my MIL.  And before today, I have never complained to her about anything she has done.  And that is what was so unbelievable about her saying, "What now Tricia?!"

I have been thinking about this all day, and I believe that my MIL'S criticism of others is escalating, and she doesn't seem to be able anymore to distinguish what criticism she should and should not be saying to vulnerable people in her family.  She has admitted to me in the last few years that she is continually getting in trouble with family member about hurtful things that she's said.  "I just got in trouble again with my daughter Dana.  I said something that got her really angry."  I am going to chalk this up to age, and we will try to discreetly make sure that her personality issues are not health-related. 

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It sounds like your MIL is losing her filter combined with the fact that she is not used to receiving any sort of complaints from you or your DH.  She appears to have led a majestic and regal life being taken out to dinner by you; having chores done for her; being hosted in your home; and getting to sit at the head of your table.  Her indulged ego couldn't handle your somewhat minor complaint that a normal person would have listened to and most likely apologized for as it was a crappy thing to say to DD2. 

I do think, however, this was your DD2's issue to take up with her GM since DD2 is an adult and the words were said to her.  I understand the mama bear instinct to defend your child, but I think DD2 should have been encouraged to talk to GM about her hurtful words. 

 

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Posted (edited)

2 hours ago, Tricia1 said:

I'm new to this, and I couldn't figure out how to reply to individual posts, so I'm responding to the three.  RoseRed135, we are both of the same mindset.  I agree with everything that you said.  In answer to your question, I don't remember if my DH spoke with MIL about the head of the table issue.  I believe the next few times that she came here for dinner, she respected it.  But last night, she did not.... Interesting... Either she forgot or she became defiant for whatever reason.

Incognito, this was the very first time I had ever said to my mother-in-law, "I'm upset with what you said ... "  I have never complained to her about anything ever.  The only thing I have ever done was a few times ask her to respect our wishes that DH sit at the head of the table. Unfortunately, she might have taken these requests as a criticism of her behavior (though deliberately disrespecting your and DH's wishes if fodder for criticism, no doubt), despite the fact that it wasn't expressed that way. In the past, my husband has always been the one to deal with any of his family matters, but none of those matters involved any complaints about my MIL from me.   But when I found out that my MIL told my daughter that she did not measure up to her cousins, I wanted to call her myself, because I felt she had crossed a line, and I wanted her to realize how hurtful I felt her words were.  Had I known that she would respond with an unreasonable rage, and not even let me speak, I would have never called her.  The only words I got out of my mouth were, "I am upset about what you said to Melanie last night." 

Skipped, number one, I have never had my husband speak to my MIL about any complaints about her from me.  I have never ever in the past told her I was upset with her.  In all the years we've been married, the only thing I have ever said to her that was in any way like a complaint was when, a few times, I asked her to please let my DH sit at the head of the table, which she does not respect.  The only thing we are guilty of is taking her out to dinners, having her to our home for dinners, celebrations and holidays, doing countless chores for her at her home, and driving her to appointments.  But in direct answer to your query, no, my husband has never voiced any complaints from me to my MIL.  And before today, I have never complained to her about anything she has done.  And that is what was so unbelievable about her saying, "What now Tricia?!" Could it have been a reaction to an accumulation of issues w/ both you and DH? Your requests that she let DH sit at the head of the table plus the "family matters" DH has dealt w/? Not saying that either you or DH were wrong, but MIL, sad to say, may just see it all as a list of "complaints."

I have been thinking about this all day, and I believe that my MIL'S criticism of others is escalating, and she doesn't seem to be able anymore to distinguish what criticism she should and should not be saying to vulnerable people in her family.  She has admitted to me in the last few years that she is continually getting in trouble with family member about hurtful things that she's said.  "I just got in trouble again with my daughter Dana.  I said something that got her really angry."  So, IOWs, it's not just happening in relation to you and yours. Good to know. Hopefully, this knowledge will make it easier for you and your DDs to take if you are ever again subjected to any of MIL's ugly comments. I am going to chalk this up to age, and we will try to discreetly make sure that her personality issues are not health-related. How can you "make sure" of this "discreetly" though? Wouldn't it be easier for DH to handle since she's his mom?

Thanks for answering us all so thoroughly, Tricia! And it's fine that you responded to 3 members in one post.

However, if you wish to reply to an individual post in the future, just click on the Quote button at the lower-left of that post. It will appear in  a smaller box w/in the Reply Box. Then you can key in your comments under the quoted post, as I'm doing here.

Or you can write on the post, itself, preferably in a different color, as I did above. In that case, to choose a color, click on the A button on the top of the Reply Box and go from there.

Edited by RoseRed135

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Could "toxic" sometimes be just be an incompatibility issue? Where two (or more) people are absolute poison to each other because they bring out the worst in each other, but each gets along just fine with other personalities?

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I think that can be a case sometimes.

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1 hour ago, ConstanceS said:

Could "toxic" sometimes be just be an incompatibility issue? Where two (or more) people are absolute poison to each other because they bring out the worst in each other, but each gets along just fine with other personalities?

I think that has to do with how someone defines 'toxic'.

For example, I think a lack of respect, empathy, combined with a need to control others equals a toxic person. Is it possible for those traits to only be exhibited towards some folks, but not others? I think so. I think it's also that not everyone views things the same. I value boundaries. Others don't. So, for *me* someone that stomps boundaries is disrespectful, and that's going to be a big issue for me. Others who don't value boundaries wouldn't be bothered by it, and therefore wouldn't see it as a respect issue, and the relationship would keep on keeping on.

As is so many other things, perspective is key.

 

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Hello everyone I am new here, I feel saddened reading many of these comments, why can't people just get on, we always like to label one another, does it really make anyone happy.

 

What does 'Toxic' mean, I suppose it depends who is labelling the person 'Toxic'. sometimes people have their own agendas for saying someone is 'Toxic', we seem to live in a world where everyone wants to control situations. we are all disposable and I think the word 'Toxic' gets overused sometimes just to get rid of someone, because it will paint someone in a certain way - whether it is true or not and once you start labelling someone 'Toxic' it sticks.

I think sometimes but not all the time before labelling someone 'Toxic' look at the bigger picture and also scrutinise the person who is doing the labelling. 

 

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NannieE welcome to our community.  I am sorry if you have had a little tiff with someone in your own family.  I hope that is cleared up in the near future.

I suppose to an outsider sometimes it might look like an offended person is simply labeling someone else as "toxic" after doing something apparently minor when actually there might be a 20 year history of major "toxic" actions preceding this and the offended person is now simply BEC and any little thing will set her off again.

What is toxic to someone else might be small potatoes to me and vice versa, but I'm sure there are years of asking/being asked to please refrain from this or that behavior and simply being ignored are even "toxicity" being ramped up.

I personally took and took and took from my own MIL because we had a family business together that my husband loved and he kept saying "just ignore her".  When my 15 year old son cut her off because of something he saw her do to me, that was the final straw...then when my college aged daughter was called a "street walker" and later accused of using her first out of college job to steal MILs money which DD had zero/no access to anyway, you better be assured she was finally labeled TOXIC by both me and my two adult children.

Some people being accused of being toxic, really are to certain people anyway.

Walk a mile in my shoes.

Edited by SueSTx

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6 hours ago, NannieE said:

Hello everyone I am new here, I feel saddened reading many of these comments, why can't people just get on, we always like to label one another, does it really make anyone happy.

 

What does 'Toxic' mean, I suppose it depends who is labelling the person 'Toxic'. sometimes people have their own agendas for saying someone is 'Toxic', we seem to live in a world where everyone wants to control situations. we are all disposable and I think the word 'Toxic' gets overused sometimes just to get rid of someone, because it will paint someone in a certain way - whether it is true or not and once you start labelling someone 'Toxic' it sticks.

I think sometimes but not all the time before labelling someone 'Toxic' look at the bigger picture and also scrutinise the person who is doing the labelling. 

 

Welcome, NannieE! Glad you decided to share your thoughts w/ us! Always good, IMO (in my opinion), to get a fresh perspective!

I think both you and Sue make some good points. No doubt, some people use the word "toxic" just b/c it's a convenient label. But, hopefully, in most cases, people don't come to that conclusion lightly. (Sue's family obviously didn't where her MIL was concerned.) Also, I agree that, sometimes, one person just can't see what the other finds so toxic. Or perhaps, say Person X's experience w/ Person Y is different than Person Z's, so one sees Person Y as toxic while the other does not.

No, I don't think that labels "make anyone happy."  I'm very cautious about assigning labels to people, myself, b/c, as you suggest Nannie, it could prevent you (general) from seeing the "bigger picture." But realizing that a relationship just isn't working and setting boundaries or giving yourself some "space" b/c of it might ease some tensions, etc.(not in every case, of course).

4 hours ago, SueSTx said:

I suppose to an outsider sometimes it might look like an offended person is simply labeling someone else as "toxic" after doing something apparently minor when actually there might be a 20 year history of major "toxic" actions preceding this and the offended person is now simply BEC and any little thing will set her off again.

What is toxic to someone else might be small potatoes to me and vice versa, but I'm sure there are years of asking/being asked to please refrain from this or that behavior and simply being ignored are even "toxicity" being ramped up.

I personally took and took and took from my own MIL because we had a family business together that my husband loved and he kept saying "just ignore her".  When my 15 year old son cut her off because of something he saw her do to me, that was the final straw...then when my college aged daughter was called a "street walker" and later accused of using her first out of college job to steal MILs money which DD had zero/no access to anyway, you better be assured she was finally labeled TOXIC by both me and my two adult children.

Some people being accused of being toxic, really are to certain people anyway.

Walk a mile in my shoes.

 

Edited by RoseRed135
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