• Announcements

    • LaToyaADMIN

      What to do if you get a "Wrong Password" message   01/21/16

      You must reset your password (even if you know it's the right one) before you can sign into the community. Thanks to the upgrade, there's an issue with passwords and signing in. The good news is that you can click here: http://community.grandparents.com/index.php?/lostpassword/ to change your password (it'll let you reuse your old one). If you can't reach the email address connected to your account then please contact the admin at latoya@grandparents.com and I'll help you sort it out. 
    • LaToyaADMIN

      Anonymous posting is back   01/21/16

      We've removed the extra step that required you to go to the full-page editor to access the anonymous post option. Now, you can reply to a post and toggle the button to post anonymous (see photo below).    Read more on anonymous posting here:    In short, the mods can see who posts as anonymous, we moderate anonymous posts the same as revealed posts, you can reply anonymously to your own topic, you may report anonymous posts.
RoseRed135

When forgiveness has mixed consequences...

9 posts in this topic

Oops! Meant to put this in The Great Debate. Moving it there now...

ETA: Done

Edited by RoseRed135

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

We all have different values, the past presidential election shows that while those on either side are nearly equal (as far as the vote is concerned anyway) there are a few that are loud spoken.  Does it mean that the majority is getting the most coverage...OR...or the few the silent majority?

I really think for each of us our personal life experiences influence our opinion the most.  I have always prided myself on being able to see both sides of an issue, and I think for most part both sides feel they are right in their present day thinking but may be proven wrong a few more years down the road.  Hind sight is 20/20 after all for most things.

Does it go back to removing anything that offends anyone? 

I really don't understand who is the final judge.

1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Arpaio is a monster.  He wasn't even "tough on crime" because he was too busy terrorizing people of color.  He deserves to rot in Hades.  Arpaio's fans are just as gross and monstrous as he is.  No decent person can like or support him.    https://static.currentaffairs.org/2017/08/wait-do-people-actually-know-just-how-evil-this-man-is

Edited by britomart
1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Granted in some circumstances the definition of pardon and forgiveness can be seen as overlapping- In this circumstance, I think, he is being pardoned lawfully- There's no forgiveness involved because he isn't being forgiven by those he mistreated-

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have been told all of my life that forgiveness is really all about me and not about the "offending" person.  In most cases he hasn't given much thought to what he did or said to offend me anyway.  Forgiveness is getting right in my heart so I can continue on with a much better attitude.

I don't know this sheriff.  I had to do research to find out his history.  He hadn't done anything to me or mine that requires forgiveness.   According to the news reports I have read, yes he is not a nice man, but haven't other presidents pardoned drug addicts and other offenders who had victims also?

I understand times are a changing, but lets put 'rules' on the people we like as well as the people we don't like.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I wish Arpaio was simply "not a nice man."  That would be a giant leap up from what he is - which is the scum that feeds on the filth on the bottom of my shoe after I've accidentally stepped in a pile of dog poop and toxic waste.  He has had inmates beaten to death and even had a mentally ill person beaten to death.  A ridiculous amount of rape cases (including ones against children) wasted away and were not investigated because he was too busy torturing inmates and harassing people who look Mexican.  He has used his position as a sheriff to abuse and murder people.  He has falsified documents to make it look like he was having his deputies do their jobs while they were clearly not - just so they could have more time to run what he fondly referred to as a "concentration camp" and harass people who look like me and my children.  

Yes, other presidents have pardoned people who I think don't deserve it.  For example, I don't agree with Ford's pardon of Nixon.  I don't agree with Clinton's pardon of Mark Rich.  However, I think that Trump's pardon of a piece of human filth like Arpaio is particularly disgusting.  It comes at a time when Trump has already shown that he sympathizes with Nazis and the KKK by defending them as "some very good people" when had their little White Power rally in Charlottesville.  And now he pardons a man who abused his power and used it to abuse and torture people in prison and torment and harass people who have brown skin.  It signals to the Nazis, KKK, and all the white supremacists that he's on their side and that they can get away with even more violence and aggression towards people of color.  It signals to me and people like me that we are second class citizens not worthy of civil rights in this country.  So, the pardon is particularly disgusting.  

Question for @SueSTx - Are you saying that just because other presidents have made controversial pardons that it makes pardoning Arpaio ok?  Also, I really don't think that drug addicts are on par with someone as despicable as Arpaio.  Drug addiction is a disease and people who are addicted to drugs need treatment.  I don't really see drug addiction much different than alcohol addiction.  It seems you think that drug addicts are bad people because of their addiction.  Do you think the same thing of alcoholics?  

Personally, I do not think taking drugs makes someone morally reprehensible.  I would be in favor of legalizing some drugs (such as marijuana) and de-criminalizing usage of certain others.  I don't think taking drugs makes someone a bad person or immoral.  I think that people who become addicted to drugs need treatment and help, much like alcoholics.  And there are many people who can and do take drugs responsibly.  I think that, generally, if what someone is doing is not harming other people then it is a waste of time and resources to criminalize it.  

Edited by britomart
1 person likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

So the answer is to take away the pardon app for all presidents starting now...I have no reason to be forgiving to anyone for that.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 8/28/2017 at 7:06 PM, SueSTx said:

So the answer is to take away the pardon app for all presidents starting now...I have no reason to be forgiving to anyone for that.

The answer is to reframe, culturally, the intent of the pardon and let the leaders we elect know that pardons are for a small group of people who might have been convicted under questionable or difficult circumstances, I.e., Lincoln's pardoning of deserters during the Civil War.

PS, most of the controversial presidential pardons usually take place at the END of a presidential administration, not at the beginning, and not during times when the person pardoned had been accused and convicted of a crime that's currently ripping the nation apart.

Arpaio didn't do anything to MY family, either, but he's cruelly and unusually torturing fellow human beings, and that's enough for me to be sickened by Trump's pardon.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!


Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.


Sign In Now